‘Will we make it to the end?’: How TV’s best comedy earned its ending

After five seasons, 12 Emmys – including four for lead actor Jean Smart – and enlisting almost every great character actor in Hollywood, Hacks is coming to an end. Its creators Jen Statsky, Lucia Aniello and Paul W. Downs couldn’t be happier.

“We feel a great sense of relief,” says Downs, speaking on Zoom hours before the season premiere in Los Angeles. “Getting to the finish line is very gratifying.”

It’s not that the trio were creatively stifled. If anything, season five proves there’s still plenty of mileage in the show’s odd-couple pairing: Deborah Vance (Jean Smart), the legendary stand-up comic who, like Joan Rivers, loves caftans, shopping network QVC, Las Vegas and crude punchlines; and Ava Daniels (Hannah Einbinder), a socially righteous bisexual Zillennial TV writer.

Paired by their manager, Jimmy (Downs), after a lull in both their careers, it’s not exactly Nichols and May at first sight – but following some teasing, blackmail and backstabbing, the two are best friends and true creative partners by season five. Despite the pair’s healthy-ish relationship, Hacks remains as sharp, cutting and charming as the five-star reviews suggest.

So why stop here? Much like Deborah’s decision at the end of season four to stick to her artistic integrity even at the cost of her dream gig as a late-night host, Downs and co. have been adamant Hacks was a five-season show, ever since they started writing it in 2015, while still working together on cult hit Broad City. They even landed on the final scene before Hacks was green-lit, including it in their successful pitch to streamer HBO Max. (In Australia, Hacks is available on Stan.) Reaching the end they had sketched out is a massive relief.

“There were plenty of moments where we thought, ‘Will we make it to the end? Will we be able to tell the full story?’, given the climate of comedy and television,” says Downs.

Launching in 2021, Hacks has not only weathered the COVID-19 pandemic, but the 2023 SAG-AFTRA writers’ strike, and a turbulent period for HBO Max amid the Warner-Discovery merger, where several finished films and series were cancelled or rescinded from streaming as a write-off.

Plus, it was far from a surefire hit. While Netflix’s Grace and Frankie showed an appetite for well-crafted comedies centred on women in their 70s, Hacks is also a satire of Hollywood’s less-sexy side, focusing on writers, agents and assistants – and without the elaborate cameos from A-list stars that Apple’s The Studio has to draw in audiences.

“Often when pitching, you’re told, ‘Don’t write something about the industry. We have enough. We don’t want to see more’,” says Downs.

“But I think Hacks is about two outsiders – two women who were cast aside by the industry. Deborah has to go to Vegas to get a casino residency, and Ava had to move to Vegas to get a job,” says Downs, alluding to Ava’s cancellation after an off-the-cuff tweet.

“And even Jimmy and Kayla [Megan Stalter] don’t fit into their alpha-male-led firm, so they strike out on their own. They’re striving for respect and dignity within that industry, and that’s what people outside of it can relate to.”

While the cast and creators of Hacks have found respect through the show’s success (particularly Einbinder and Stalter, two previously underground comedians who are now considered leading talents), the show’s characters are still clawing towards it in season five.

At the forefront is Deborah’s determination to literally rewrite her legacy after a pre-emptive obituary in TMZ leads with her recently axed late-night show. Setting her sights on selling out Madison Square Garden – an unmistakable, concrete accomplishment for a comic – she and Ava work around a vindictive non-compete agreement to sell tickets. It’s a premise that allows Hacks to go all-out without losing its emotional weight.

While Deborah can’t advertise her show directly, she can compete on The Amazing Race with estranged daughter DJ (Kaitlin Olson) – essentially an elaborate ruse to let the It’s Always Sunny in Philadelphia star engage in a feat of physical comedy involving a steep hill and a cheese wheel.

There’s also no law against Deborah’s May-December showmance with a rockstar (The Summer I Turned Pretty heartthrob Christopher Briney) for tabloid attention. It’s a bold plot line that plays for laughs until it doesn’t – a tough balance for which Hacks has become known.

“It’s something that we talk about constantly because we want to be a very high joke-per-minute show, partially because Deborah and Ava would be cracking wise a lot,” says Downs. “They talk in joke form – Deborah will be doing punchline jokes in a way you don’t [usually] get in a hospital.

“It was a sort of cheat code for us. We were always striving for a tone that was hard-funny, but also emotional and has heart…. There’s constantly a discussion of making sure that nothing is too broad and outlandish or too saccharine and melodramatic. We were trying to keep it as real and grounded as we can.”

Downs says that often involves cutting jokes, whether in the script, shooting or editing. It’s all in favour of keeping a scene’s natural flow, though there are exceptions: “There are certain things that we’re like, ‘That’s too funny to lose. That’s going to stay, even if it’s a little bit outlandish. We got to keep it’.”

One particularly outlandish episode almost feels like “Avorah” fan-fiction – the name given by fans who hope Hacks′ protagonists fall in love. Deborah and Ava play pretend as a couple, in an elaborate ruse to win over a lesbian comic (Cherry Jones) who Deborah used to make jokes about. For the record, Downs says they didn’t write the episode for Avorah fans, but they knew it’d cause a reaction.

“Because it’s a comedy about comedy, it felt like a classic farce – one that felt really right for Hacks,” says Downs. “But we were happy it would scratch an itch for some people.”

‘The show is about comedy, but it’s also a love story between these two characters.’

Paul W. Downs, co-creator of Hacks

As far as feverish fandoms go, Avorah isn’t that off the money, though. Deborah and Ava are deeply dysfunctional, capable of a great cruelty to each other only achievable through deeply knowing and loving someone.

“At its heart, the show is about comedy, but it’s also a love story between these two characters,” says Downs. “Whether you call it a dark mentorship or a buddy comedy or a love story, it’s about these two people.”

While none of Hacks creators have a penchant for blonde bouffants or blackmail, Downs sees the show as deeply personal, noting he, Aniello (who is also his wife) and Statsky share Deborah and Ava’s insatiable desire to create the perfect joke.

“That secret love language, it’s what the whole show’s about,” he says. “It’s very autobiographical for us. We feel so lucky that Jen, Lucia and I found each other, and continue to make each other laugh.

“If you’re devoted to [comedy], it’s because you find it to be more than a job … It better be when you’re feeling most alive, when you’re making jokes with somebody. Because it can be a grind, and it can also be the greatest thing in the world.”

Hacks (season five) is streaming on Stan* now.

*Stan is owned by Nine, which also owns this masthead.

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